⚠️ PSA to all Germans ⚠️

Starting tomorrow, Telekom and Telefonica will hand over your phone's movement data to the government and other authorities.

It is opt-out, not opt-in!

Deactivate ASAP.

Telekom: optout-service.telekom-dienste


@Myrrdin just so it gets boosted more's a serious issue

@Myrrdin @koyu half the people i know here are in germany. i don’t know german, and a couple of them don’t either.

@LunaDragofelis telefonica and therefore o2, they're both in the same network afaik

German cellular network ownership intricacies 

German cellular network ownership intricacies 

German cellular network ownership intricacies 

@koyu ist das nur bei Telekom und Telefonica? Oder macht das Vodafone auch irgendwann?

@Lazol bin mir nicht 100%ig sicher. Das müsste man nochmal nachschauen.

@koyu phew

good thing i'm using Vodafone, right? right??

@koyu @hirojin In the Vodafone app there are many opt-ins or opt-outs. I don't know if any of them is for location stuff, but they've all been on "off" for me.

@koyu BTW at least in the Telefonica case this is nothing new, I actually disabled it before. (you see your status when you enter your number there)

@koyu die Telefonica Seite scheint auch für Blau zu funktionieren...

Bei Premium-SIM kann ich mich zwar mit Handynummer/Pin auf der Seite anmelden, dann hab ich aber keinen Abmelden-Button 😬

@lauteshirn @koyu @hermlon

Bei O2 lag das bei mir am mobilen Browser. Dort fehlte bei mir auch der Abmelden-Button. Ich habe de Prozedur nochmals mit Firefox auf dem Laptop gemacht, da ging es problemlos und der Button war da.

Danke für den Tipp. Vielleicht liegts am Werbeblocker oder einem anderen Add-on.
@koyu @hermlon

@lauteshirn @koyu @hermlon
Ich hatte Ublock Origin auf dem Laptop an. Ich glaube, das lag wirklich am Browser. Ich benutze auf dem Handy mobil Firefox klar. Dort fehlte der Button.

@Billie @lauteshirn @koyu @hermlon im normalen Firefox mobile fehlt er auch. Im Destokmodus ist er da.
Ist es rechtens dass der anonymen Statistiknutzung widersprochen und nicht eingewilligt werden muss?

@Bobo_PK @Billie @lauteshirn @koyu @hermlon Aktuell ist das die Situation, ja. Ein Teil unserer im Januar(!) gestarteten Konsultation ist es, die Frage der Anonymisierung rechtlich neu zu betrachten. Wobei anonymisierte Mobilfunkdaten tatsächlich für eine Reihe von Prozessoptimierungen geeignet sind. Aber die Auswertung und Bewertung der eingereichten Stellungnahmen können wir nicht ad-hoc vornehmen.

@lauteshirn @koyu @hermlon
Hängt am Browser...
Gestern auch Probleme gehabt mit Chrome Mobile und Safari.
Firefox Mobile ging ohne Probleme.
Desktop Browser hab ich auch noch keine negative Rückmeldung bekommen.

@hermlon @koyu
Diese Anbieter sollte die Abmeldung über den Telefonicalink funktionieren... für den fall das nicht bitte Rückmeldung...
Tchibo mobil
Ortel Mobile
K-Classic Mobil (Kaufland)

@koyu I've read through the Telefonica information and I'm concerned in its current state. The data is quite anonymized e.g. it is atomar so that you know how many women have been in the area and how many people of an age but you can't say how many women of that age were there. The data is also slightly changed randomly so you don't know exact times ages etc. BUT they want t o use it not just for group analysis but also for personalized marketing

@koyu It might be worth mentioning that the data is at least anonymized and they put quite some thought to how to do that effectively. Nevertheless, the collection of movement profiles really should be opt-in in the first place.

@koyu opt out is problematic, but if it can't be retroactively enabled, I'm not sure that's a wise advice
@koyu > Telefonica handing over stuff to governments

in other news, H2O is wet

I was allowed to opt-out at both providers with the same number. Is that normal? Do they (I mean Telefonica and Telekom) allow/do cell tower sharing, or something like that (newbie to that)? If so, everybody who wants to opt-out, should opt-out for both! If it was implied with your toot, I didn't get that. Thank you very much for your post!

@eutektoid @koyu In that case you must have used both links in quick succession. Looks like the opt-in/opt-out state is shared. I entered two numbers using one link, then tried the same a couple of minutes later using the second link. Here I only managed to (re)register the first number--for the second I saw a message stating "You've already opted out".

@koyu I'm not a German and not even a EU resident, but how is this legal under the GDPR?

@grishka @koyu I guess it isn't but nobody cares 😢 The big companies all don't care about the GDPR because you can make very much money with selling the data and the risk that anyone takes action against it seems to be pretty low 😕 Just have a look at some of the big German websites.Not one of them is GDPR compliant: They *must* ask before embedding trackers with cookies but they actually load them before they ask and it makes no difference if you click ok or not.

@nipos @grishka @koyu Have a look at article 3 of the #GDPR:
W.r.t. cookies: Some are necessary (and therefore allowed), some are not. And I sincerely doubt that "big German websites" (still) don't care, because they risk *hefty* fines. Check the respective privacy policies...

@koyu @Gargron do you know if it‘s also planned for the Telekom daughters like congstar as well?

@meet_judith @Gargron i'm at mobilcom/debitel so these are affected as well (and i have heard about blau on the telefonica side)

@koyu god the telefonica site is garbage on mobile
Cant get further then step 3 because it cuts off the part i have to tap to get to step 4 and opt out

@Jonly @koyu Didn’t work unfortunately. But after 3 tries I now have to wait 24hrs to try again. What a nightmare of a web service.

Try using the desktop version of the website. That should work better for e.g. FF.
@Jonly @koyu

@schokopflaster @Jonly @koyu Did you forget to strip the local/international prefix (0049/0)? It worked for me afterwards (you'll receive a SMS right away) ...

@m_ueberall @Jonly @koyu Nah, the SMS thing worked for me. They just never showed the „abmelden“ button.

@schokopflaster @m_ueberall @Jonly if you try to opt-out from the telekom you don't have an "abmelden" button. once you sent the code from the sms to the website it will be opt-out automatically. the "opt-out" is just an anonymization of the data anyway so yes, data will still be collected.

@koyu @m_ueberall @Jonly Yeah, telekom worked fine for me. (Unfortunately I‘m not with Telekom but E-Plus/Aldi Talk/Telefonica so I absolutely don’t know whether the Telekom opt out is sufficient or not.)

Der Telekom Opt-Out betrifft ausdrücklich nur die Anonymisierung und Übermittlung der Daten an die Motionlogic GmbH.

@koyu any (english, if possible) source about that?

@angristan @koyu DLF radio mentioned it. They check whether the people stay indoors as demanded by processing the gps profiles of the mobiles. Is is official.

The site told me to click on "Abmelden" to opt out. There was no "Ambelden" to click on. I tried in two browsers and in desktop mode and had to re-verify my phone number every time. I still haven't found the Abmelden but they refuse to send me SMS for 24 hours now.

Ich dachte immer für die Weitergabe von Daten an dritte besteht eine #Informationspflicht nach #dsgvo und dort ist auch beschrieben das opt-out sowie abmelden mit Hürden nicht erlaubt ist.

est-ce qu'on peut opt-out en france aussi ? je sais plus où j'ai lu que le gouvernement avait fait ça aussi

@koyu Does this help? Well, leave your phone at the desk, when going away.

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